ATTENTION FORUM

[Zack]

Fuck the official DP metagame. It's fucking stupid. I'll tell you right now, there is no fucking way in hell we are implementing all the shit DP has.

I'm open to a few ideas, but to include all the new moves, traits, Pokemon, and any other changes, no. The metagame is faggotry.

Moves either have no purpose, are uber powerful, or only work well in specific situations. And the fucking names are HORRIBLE. METEORIC SWARM? Yeah, because when I think about dragons, I definitely think of megaton rock-bugs.

DP is a money-milker, that is it. To include all of DP would be an insult to us. There really isn't a metagame to learn, you just find a Pokemon, give it 4 moves and kill kill kill. It's a game for elementary school children, who can boast about getting A:LKDJFLKASF, the new God Pokemon, before his friends, so he rapes their level 45 CHARIZARD and level 4 Pikachu, because the dumb faggot doesn't know how to level train his team.

When I saw the amount of Fire types getting Solarbeam, and all the different typed moves that DP implemented on each Pokemon, I quit caring. To give every Pokemon of a certain non-STAB type a specific move is to kill any differentiating factors from those Pokemon. The only difference between Houndoom and Arcanine is that Houndoom is Dark typed. The useful moves that they have are pretty much what every Fire type has, and they both have Crunch, only Houndoom has STAB and Arcanin gets better ATK to use it.

It already bothered me that almost every Normal type in ADV had basically the same TM listing.

I'm open to certain sides of the argument for the special/attack switch, like Crabhammer and such. We'd have to have a huge discussion sometime about the change, preferably on AIM or MSN with a relatively large group.

BTW, do not reply to this thread. All I need you to know is that you all should quit seeing things planned in this game as being planned for DP game mechanics. We'll decide everything, not Nintendo, when it comes to new mechanics. I'm trying to make a game where each Pokemon stands out from others that it shares a type with. Up until now, it's been secondary types and stats, well now I'm trying to make movepools seem a little more unique (while still having some blending and such so we don't just say "oh Charizard does everything Typhlosion can do, but better, so fuck Typhlosion" and blagh blagh blagh, I don't get it.

DP is Gauntlet Legends of Pokemon. Fuck-fuck-fuckshitup and that's about it.

[cock_block]

D/P's metagame does not look like it will be fun, useful or something necessary. It - for lack of a better word - blows.

The below is a rant from another thread you might want to consider reading:

Strategy isn't gone per se, but the concept of the wall is becoming harder to visualize. Or at least the concept of the physical wall. I maintain Regice and Blissey will still be strong walls and capable of handling the change. Physicals, however, are different.

With Dragon Claw now running off the physical attack stat, nothing walls Dragonite or 'Mence guaranteed anymore. With the exception of Suicune, there is not a single water type that can switch into CB Dragon Claw (or whatever move he has that SEs on you) and not be 2HKOed by the follow up hit (unless it is faster and has Ice Beam like Starmie, but that's just scarying CBmence away temporarily and Starmie still takes about 80% HP from the Dragon Claw so the point is reduced slightly). Waters can no longer stop up Dragons, which is not comforting.

Then you have every single move rising in base power. Physically, that is. Rock type Cross Chop (aka Stone Edge), Brave Bird, a million new forms of Double-Edge, improved Superpower that lowers defense/special defense instead of attack (that is huge btw) have all added big numbers onto damage dealt. Not to mention the multitudes of 80 power moves (at least 2 for every type) that gives everything insane attacking diversity and a very generic feel to every pokemon.

Consequently, the new defenders of this generation simply can not keep up with the overwhelming numbers that these new attacks throw up on the boards. Dootakun, who I thought would really help balance the metagame, has been a disappointment. Its 116 split defenses and 67 HP makes it seem okay defensively but it takes a depressingly high amount from DDtar Crunch (40 - 45% after a single DD even if you have max defense and HP). And that's not taking into consideration that the only thing Dootakun can do in response to this violation is throw a shitty Luster Cannon at DDtar. And that's assuming DDtar doesn't have Fire Punch, which is expected to be considered on some versions because of Dotaitos.

The only real challenge in building your DDtar is picking:

Stone Edge, Earthquake, Crunch, Fire Punch? Which ones to pick? Stone Edge should be there for obvious reasons with Earthquake on the side but Crunch or Fire Punch? Crunch prevents Swamperta and Claydol from ever thinking he could wall me whereas Fire Punch stops up Dotaitos period. Or should I even consider trying Ice Fang for shits and giggles (and Flygon/Claydol).

Frankly, if your only issue is picking whether you counter Dotaitos or Dookatun versus Swampert and Claydol, there is something mildly digusting. In some ways, it's almost a choice based on which your team has more problems with and of those three, none of them are particularly threatening. One shoots shitty Luster Beams off a "mighty" 79 base satk, the others are ground types that can collectively be covered by any grass type with decent defenses. Or use the souped up Dusclops evo, he covers everything.

Offensively, this metagame has gone through quite the revolution. Fire types, which previously sucked, have gained a ton of crazy shit. The new monkey makes Blaziken obselete as a sweeper with Scheme, Swords Dance (yes, both), 104 attack stats and 108 speed. Nothing can switch into it safely. If you don't believe me, then you will when you also hear it gets the fire double-edge, a 120 power fighting move, rock slide, thunderpunch and can even support Hidden Power Ice or something if you must OHKO 'Mence on the switch. With minimal EV investment. Arcanine is liberated as Reversaller. Ninetales has Scheme. Everything has solar beam. Everything has Stone Edge. Everything has offensive options.

Defensively, we are much more limited. Skarmory, Weezing and Regirock can't wall shit anymore now that fighting and ground are even more popular and even BIGGER base powers are being thrown around. Resistances are easier to work around because of bigger movepools and - when in doubt - just punch through. Flygon barely avoided a 2HKO with Rock Slide; imagine how he'll react when he sees a 100 base power rock move with CH potential coming his way. Or, for the obscure case, Ice Fang/Beam and potential Crunch. The same principle applies to waters on moreso because waters relied on being able to SE on heavy hitters while their typing didn't let the opponent get an advantage. However, the new base power increase has thoroughly negated the need for having to SE the water type. Just punch through it. CB Dragon Claw from Sala or 'Nite 2HKOs Milotic, Swampert and the new ground/water bulky water. Earthquake Enperuto if he shows up. Then it's just pokemon beats pokemon with move.

On the special side of things, we still have a semblance of order. Blissey and Regice still run the show with Snorlax to a lesser degree. In terms of specials, things have held up defensively and made it much more balanced. There are ways special sweepers can beat Blissey/Snorlax/Regice but that existed in ADV too so it's nothing new.

I realize I've ranted but to summarize... I think the physical side of pokemon has been overly simplified and there has been a visible push for a purely offensive metagame. The special side is still balanced to some degree but the overpowering offense of the physical spectrum will - in my opinion - bleed into the special and make having a special wall less and less important as teams become more and more like 4 sweepers, supporter with useful resistances 1, supporter with useful resistances 2.

[Zack]

So, to conclude, Dragon_Hawk and I will be working together to straighten out what Nintendo fucked up. If you all want DP mechanics, we'll work on balancing it. But I'm warning you, it won't be pretty.

[Zack]

Since I figure this thread title grabs peoples' attention to it, I'll just post this here as well.

In our game, there will be some slight... battle chart changes.

is resistant to and .

's weakness to is going to be debated soon.

[CyberMewtwo]

say what?!?

rock should most def be weak against grass logicly.

as for the ice.... i mean, im a huge water/ice fan but... idk... should we really be playing around with the type matches? feels so wrong somehow

cant we just make a few resistant traits? like for our dragons, give em a trait that makes them immune or something to ice attacks?

[Zack]

The idea that would have a chance to be immune to is one of the most rediculous ideas I've ever heard, no offense.

I'm adjusting the resistances, because defensively, it is the worst type in the game. Being weak to and only resisting itself makes it almost impossible to make any type defensive.

Now let's look at the changes my proposal adds:

Cloyster can wall physical and Pokemon now.
Jynx now takes neutral damage from and which helps her shit Defense.
Sneasel and Weavile are 4x resistant to and which helps their shit Defense.
Articuno and Regice are now safer switches to Salamence (who got a huge boost in DP with physical-based Dragon Claw -_-) and other rediculous attacks.
Piloswine can now take a hit.

There aren't that many Ice types to begin with, so very little would change, besides maybe Jynx seeing more play.

[CyberMewtwo]

well if you think about it dragons are considered reptiles which are cold blooded and cant really control their body temperature. whenever lizards or turtles or frogs or w/e are put in cold climates they go into a sort of hibernate state. and we all know too much cold can be a dangerous thing so i'm guessing this is sorta where this weakness trait came from.

but the game designers put it there for a good reason. everything needs a balance. if it wernt for all the grass/water types HUGe advantage, rock pkmn would be used alot more.i mean what else is good against dragons that is widly used? the programmers just wanted to make sure dragon types wouldnt dominate a match so easily hence the strategies and manuvers different trainers use.

i mean i'll still program w/e you want me to but i'm prolly not ganna agree with 100% of it all.

actually this brings up an idea. maybe we can set the game with different mods players can choose to play with at the beginning of the game or something? Traditional, Advanced, or Delta? and THAT will determine which things get switched around (type advantages, move pools, statmods, ect...) for the player

[Zack]

Dude, that's an assload of programming on your part.

This proposal of Ice's adjustments is in NO way finalized, but I'm trying to help out.

I may drop the resistance, but I know I want to keep for sure. I guess is up in the air as well, but I'm leaning more towards keeping that resistance I proposed.

[CyberMewtwo]

its a simple if/then. i was ganna have the original database set along with our mods but yeah. just an if then should do it. not too much programming. but yeah lol it could be done if anything.

[Zack]

I'd honestly prefer just to have my adjustments, so there isn't any problem with people playing on the modserver, but I think we'll have a vote on it sometime soon.

[CyberMewtwo]

they could just load it from the modserver site directly, i mean what i was thinking of doing is just having the database modlist downloaded automaticly when the players connect online (which would make changes alot easier), that way they cant hack the lil freaking txt file which i'm still unsure of how to encrypt within sphere (so i'm thinking ima have to write a separate normal program file to run with this one which could help to make sure noone hacks the open sphere scripts and start changing the rules). the other day i spent the whole day tryin to figure out anti-hack measures but i everything i thought of i immediatly thought of the exact way to counter it. >_< damnit. lol but yeah ima have a totally separate modserver thing but our database can be downloaded from the internet. we post it on our site and bam. its set and done ready to use on our server. ^_^ also if we have differ servers with our game, ppl can prolly add some of their own mods to it (that is ofcourse if you want them to have other servers - personally im still undesisive about that so i'm leaving that totally up to you).

[Zack]

Yeah but then you have discrepencies between how people are playing. Someone who has Ice resist Dark on their selection might battle someone who has Ice not resist Dark, and there is a problem.

The modserver won't have a choice. If people don't like the Ice adjustments, then people don't have to play on my modserver. The game can have that option though, at least single player mode, since there won't be a problem with battling others. MMO, if we use that, might be a problem, but we'll cross that bridge once we finish single player game and move on to MMO.

[CyberMewtwo]

Has anyone found me the Status Ailment Pictures? i still need PSN, SLP, PAR, ect....

i tried looking but no luck. i'm about ready to take snapshots from my freaking roms to get em.

[Zack]

I'll do my best to find some status images ;o

[CyberMewtwo]

.... noone's said anything about the new layout i made....

._.


T_T

[cock_block]

I like the new layout. =D It's smexy.

The pokeballs can be confusing at times but they mostly speak for themselves.

[CyberMewtwo]

Well i'll setup a key in alil bit but for the meantime I am proud to announce that I have taken full advantage to the Censored Word List inorder to make our Pokemon Tasks Easier to Complete (or atleast do them in a funner way).

basicly instead of linking to all of Khold's Type Images, all you have to do now is write ":type:" and the image will replace it. Example: try typing in :normal : (without the space), ect.

This should come in really handy for the Official Move Changes Thread. Granted I was hoping to somehow make new smileys for them isntead of censoring but as long as it gets the job done.


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[Zack]

*khold used HAPPINESS EXPLOSION*